Andreas Heldal-Lund, the founder of OCMB, used to be a free speech advocate, famously helping Tory Christman to post on his website when she was still a Scientologist – knowing she was going to post pro-Scientology ideas. When Tory asked him why he was helping her, he replied, “Because I believe in the freedom of speech.”
Tory said this helped to get her out of Scientology.
But recently, a post by Angry Gay Pope on OCMB was put into the “dustbin” which I believe should not have been. But hey – now as part of the Anti Scientology Mafia Network, OCMB has to control the information people see, don’t they?
Information control in the anti-Scientology movement is one of the most dangerous developments I have seen occur over the last couple of years. I do not agree with AGP’s tactics all the time. But I will never agree that he should be silenced.
Here’s AGP’s post in full:
Earlier this year Nasty Nathanial, GI Jenny and I visited Twin Peaks. That’s the cult base where LRH’s words are stored on metal plates to survive WW III. Jenny took our photo while there.
Over the next few months I bugged BusinessInsider.com to print the photos we took. I thought they forgot then I got emails recently finalizing this story: http://www.thisisinsider.com/scientolog … und-2017-8
Unfortunately the reporter posted it for me to fact check and I reposted his link before proofing. OOPS! MY MISTAKE. Nevertheless he fixed several errors ASAP: He confused Tony Ortega with AnonOrange and said Tony and I went to Twin Peaks together, Nasty Nathanial and Angry Thetan were not credited for their photos/videos. I wish we posted the story differently but beggars can’t be choosers when it comes to convincing people to do a Sci story. Some outlets are still afraid. All errors were fixed within 24 hours. The story will be running FOREVER (this is the Internet after all).
Tony and I would never go to Twin Peaks together as we hate each other and, as an editorial desk guy, he does not have the balls to actually show up at a beat reporter location like this with even the slightest danger of arrest.
Meanwhile Tony Ortega must have five computer monitors running at all times to constantly monitor social media about himself. Within minutes of posting to Facebook Chuck Beatty emailed me to say “Tony is upset with you on his blog: https://disqus.com/by/t0ny0rteg4/ ”
I didn’t know Tony had a mini-blog which is a twitter type discussion on his main blog. Does he ever stop typing? Then he got a moral nose bleed sitting atop his high horse. As you know, he OWNS this story. Or does the story own him?
“Trying to get through to the idiot editors at the Business Insider to get them to change their bullshit article that relies on a lot of self-serving crap from Donald Myers, including utter falsehoods about me that they never checked with me about…
— No, I never visited Twin Peaks with Myers, and no, Myers has never met with the woman who spotted Shelly in Crestline. (Just checked with her on that.)
— Myers did not shoot the drone footage over the Twin Peaks compound, even though he has put a copyright notice on footage that someone else shot.”
Well, I never put my copyright or web page watermark on anything Angry Thetan has done. He’s also given me his blessing to re-post his videos and use them wherever. I’m the one that turned on Leah Remini’s show to them. Reposting his videos protects Angry Thetan from church takedowns as there is more than one copy publicly viewable. Tony certainly enjoys lashing out without fact checking himself. He seems to see what he wants.
“I just talked to her on the phone and she said she never met and talked with you. Emails from her prove that she did? Are you fucking high?”
I sent him her emails. I even sent him a photo she claimed to have taken of Twin Peaks. I finally convinced him we have communicated THAT way but he replied with a series of obscene emails accusing me of INTIMIDATING HER.
“I asked her if she met with you and spoke to you, as you told the BI. She denied it. She said she drove by but did not meet with you or talk to you. And yes, I still have the email you sent her in which you tried to intimidate her. You really want to push me on this, you lying sack of shit?”
ANGRY GAY POPE: WHAT email? For doing what?
I have NINE emails from this woman saying things like
TWIN PEAKS LADY: “Hello, I have some recent pictures of the Twin Peaks compound we were followed after we left and some weird things of been happening. My hubby and I live about 2 miles from compound and we think we have seen the lady that looked Shelly before, last year? The only reason why she caught my eye as she was small and thin and didn’t look like she should be with the two men that were with her. When I saw the new TV show I recognized her. If you would like any more information I would love to share with you.”
I have never sent her a single message that was harassing or intimidating in any way. Why would I? What would my motivation be?
SO I emailed her on 09/25/2017 and she did not respond. I called her on 09/28 and she answered the phone sounding drugged and didn’t want to talk. Was she drugged on chemo, or was this an act? I don’t know.
ABOUT TWIN PEAKS LADY: She claims to be on chemo. She and I talked several times before the protest and then on the day of the protest. She arranged to come protest with us but, when the time came, she just drove up with a friend and dropped off a small, hand painted particle board sign for us to use. She was wearing a surgical face mask as she said she was concerned about germs. Many Anons used to wear those so it did not weird me out. The sign was totally useless for protesting as it was tiny. Nobody in a car driving by could see it. So we left it for the Sci’s as a souvenir.
PROTEST SIGN TWIN PEAKS LADY MADE ME:
https://www.facebook.com/angrygaypope/p … 61/?type=3
So now Tony is publicly accusing me of being harassing to an allegedly sick woman and not reporting true facts. The woman involved won’t talk to me and neither will Tony.
But Nasty Nathanial, my intrepid assistant, heard us talk on the phone that day and saw her show up in the car. She had also contacted him via phone before the protest day.
NASTY NATHANIAL: This is very puzzling to me because I was there at the Scientology’s Twin Peaks compound and I met the lady who claimed to have seen Shelly Miscavige in nearby Crestline. I had also communicated with her in the days leading up to our trip to Twin Peaks. She told me she knew who the Angry Gay Pope was and was a fan of his videos. I watched her pull up in a vehicle outside of the compound and hand Pope a protest sign. I don’t know how she can claim she never met the Pope or that he harassed her. I seem to lean towards the belief that OSA bots got to her and that is why she is changing her story. They probably scared her. We’ve seen this before from OSA.
That is a very good angle.
IF she is truthful then OSA would almost surely go after her. She claims to have a lot of security and connections in the criminal justice system, but claims she is ill (they love that. Makes you weaker and an easier target.). Months have passed. Did they contact her and threaten her in the interim?
IF she is lying she still made a big PR stink about Shelly over nothing. They would go after her for that, too.
Either she is lying or Tony is lying. All three people’s credibility is questioned and now I’m publicly accused by the main Sci protester of being some harassing monster. Yet no evidence has been presented to me or the public. Harassment/stalking is right out of the OSA playbook regarding what to accuse your enemies of. And note how Tony quickly devolved into obscenity and used words like “dude.” With a BA in English I would never talk that way.
Worst of all, if she is lying that means the Shelly story is false, and that’s sad.
I was burned recently for repeating a story about David Miscavige being thrown off of a plane. When the National Enquirer checked into for me they found no evidence of it (and they will run a story with FALSE evidence!)
I don’t want to get burned again and have my credibility affected.
And here’s what Chuck Beatty has to say about AGP’s post – also trashed to the dustbin:
“CHUCK BEATTY: Wow! Excellent work, and keeping up with CST! YOu know that this just makes Miscavige pissed beyond belief, those are just TWO of the hottest things in the world.
My guess is CST houses some other treasures of Hubbard’s never revealed, like possibly a stash of riches (gold most likely) in case “money” is needed, also, in case of a nuclear disaster scenario. Hubbard’s ideas to to dig up treasure he’d hidden in past lives, was behind Hubbard’s “Mission Into Time” adventure of 1968. Extrapolating, I think also that either at this CST site where Shelly most likely is, or at one of the other ones, they’ve stashed some treasure/wealth in some metallic form, for the “future” meaning WAY into the future, or in case for Hubbard to have when he “comes back” which is delusional, but it “fits” Hubbard’s mentality, and Miscavige likes to do what Hubbard says.
My opinion, it’s kind of advanced cult brainwashing, but it’s the “prison of belief” prison that Shelly will have put HERSELF into whatever her duties are there. Shelly KNOWS that the CST jobs are the most important longer range Hubbard ordered jobs. CST jobs are doing LRH’s final long range wishes, and she will be honored and privileged in her own “prison of belief” mind to be doing the highest level secretive stuff.
When I was at ASI in LA, the ASI traffic has a few writings that LRH says that he wishes the BULK of his wealth to go to CST, minus small amounts for his then wife Mary Sue and his children (minus his earlier children like Nibs and Katherine, they got NOTHING in Hubbard’s will). Hubbard’s will, I read it, laid out giving his wealth to CST (and CST as a corporation didn’t exist, the will is written to give Hubbard’s wealth to the “archives project”).
CST is the “archives project.” It is the highest of high secrets, and thus, your going to CST and making constant newsworthy photos of the place, that is JUST a mega bingo bullseye!
And Shelly’s name, just a goad to end all goads to Miscavige.
My other speculation, is that he may have divorced her, and that he might be secretly remarried to Laurisse, “Lou” of the photos of him and Lou.
That would be what I’d do, if I were him, and I’d trust that Shelly just does what she knows is her duty to LRH, which is carry out the CST wishes of LRH, who is really someone that Shelly has more respect to, long range, compared to Miscavige. Shelly on the Apollo vessel, spent years, being a lower commodore’s messenger to Hubbard, and then later she was a junior messenger also. (Janis Grady’s book on the Commodore’s Messengers is a dry long detailed read, but you learn that Shelly at first was NOT some big cheese, she has only risen up since the falling by the wayside of the OTHER higher and longer vintage earlier commodore’s’ messengers, and Shelly and David Miscavige were “lower” messengers to the other messengers who fell by the wayside when David took over!)
So Shelly, really, in her heart, I speculate, will stay at CST not because Miscavige is punishing her with that as a cult prison for her, but also because I’ve seen in the case of Annie Broker, and in the case of Robin Lindsell, this pattern of the highest of high people, when they fall from grace, they are put into the maintenance of LRH’s actual archival belongings and things that Hubbard personally wished cared for. There are a lot of doo-dads at CST which Dylan can tell you about, which are Hubbard’s doo-dads, his cameras, his clothing, etc, etc, all of which Shelly would be honored to caretake and preserve.
So, she will most of the time be also honored to be there.
Now, how browbeaten and bedraggled she feels, for failing to reach all the wishes her husband David wished for her, she’s also just consumed with guilt for “failing” in his eyes, too.
So she’s living a headful of bullshit that no one should be living in their heads, but it’s not just Miscavige’s prisoner wife, is all.
You’re the best, AGP.
Information control in Anti-Scientology is one of the worst things for Exes I can think of. But this trend with what I am calling the “Anti-Scientology Mafia Network” has gotten worse and worse over the last couple of years.
Happily, they are not in control of me.
They never have been, and they never will be.
And by the way, Tony Ortega’s extreme disrespect and obscenity that appear in the email quotes that AGP prints above are exactly the kind of language and attitudes that I have seen from him in back-channel communications, as well.
In my opinion, Tony Ortega is a hyper-controlling narcissist who is badly in need of a series of anger management courses and a couple of journalism refreshers on how to spot your own bias. As the most biased person writing about Scientology today, I believe his stories need MUCH more questioning than they have been getting from the Ex/Anti community.
Any influence Tony Ortega has had on Scientology and the Aftermath Season 2, for instance, has sent the show into the toilet after a stellar and brilliant Season 1. The episodes that Tony Ortega has had the most influence over have been shown to be the least viewed and the least popular episodes.
I think all Exes should review their relationship with Tony Ortega and his over-the-top bias. Don’t let him control your thoughts, or the content of other critics and Exes, with regard to Scientology.
23 thoughts on “Did Twin Peaks lady who “saw Shelly” LIE to TONY ORTEGA? by Angry Gay Pope”
Why didn’t AGP post the emails HE wrote to ‘Rachel’?
He posted an email she sent to him.
Why not post the emails he sent to her? Especially if he wants to exonerate himself from allegations that his emails were threatening and/or intimidating.
Seems to me that would be the easiest way to clear up any confusion.
Yeah but Tony Ortega’s self serving accusations aren’t worth defending against. Just wait until you get one leveled at you.
Is AGP the newly designated enemy for the Undies to go after now?
Are marauding Undies going to descend upon him where ever he posts, call him a “troll”, try to get him banned, and generally work as hard as they can to discredit him now?
Is he your newest Emmanuel Goldstein?
Haven’t you been around long enough by now to identify the pattern, Chee?
If Tony’s “self serving accusations aren’t worth defending against” why did you write an entire post about it?
Seems to me there is a simple solution. Note AGP’s response “I have never sent her a harassing email……..so I emailed her on 9/25/2017…..”
If he has nothing to hide, release his emails. He had no problem releasing hers.
If I had been accused of writing harassing emails, I would publish what I had written immediately……unless of course they were harassing in nature.
Note AGP then questions whether or not ‘Rachel’ is actually going through chemo.
And that is relevant why?
I’m not here to answer for AGP, only to expose the information control in Anti-Scientology and do what I can to act against it.
By posting the AGP piece you are posting one side of a story. As you yourself say, it is important to get all the evidence.
Nothing that Chee posted here is unreasonable, not sure why you descended into the name calling and accusations, the very thing you decry.
I don’t decry accusations. Name-calling maybe.
I think “Undies” is a good name for Underground Bunkerites, don’t you?
And I think there is substantial evidence that the more marauding the Undies do, the more they become soiled.
Excuse me, but we prefer the more formal ‘Underoos’
Alanzo, you are doing precisely the same thing you are accusing another of. Like Chee Chaulker said post the entire email chain. It’s stupid to talk about when you only have half the story. And with half the story you are going to go Ah Ha see Tony Ortega is a scumbag,
I don’t have the email chain. I only have what AGP posted and which was thrown into the “dustbin” in order to suppress what AGP wrote. We never have the whole story in anything having to do with Scientology. The whole activity of Scientology criticism is piecing together what different people have – which is why information control is so important to fight in anti-Scientology.
We’ve always fought it from Scientology, but now we have to fight it from anti-Scientologists themselves.
AGP was there, Tony wasn’t. Friends of AGP met the woman in person, Tony never has. Tony wants all this suppressed so no one sees it. Why do you think that is?
Tony’s words speak for themselves. He does treat people like he treats AGP in back-channel emails. Tony Ortega does have a self-interested agenda, and a colossal bias, that too few people see. This lack of information makes people unable to critically evaluate what Tony Ortega writes. And so he is able to play them like little kittens with a red-dot laser pointer.
This has nothing to do with AGP “intimidating a witness”. It has everything to do with critically questioning Tony Ortega’s reporting on Shelly Miscavige. These are facts Tony Ortega will never tell you because they undermine his own story-telling. And the horrifying thing about the state of Scientology criticism right now is that he is able to get these facts suppressed on OCMB, and you don’t care.
Do you understand that?
Alanzo, AGP has made the decision to not show the email chain, you know how email works.
AGP reports that he showed Tony Ortega all the email communications between AGP and the woman who supposedly reported seeing Shelly with “two minders”, as Tony characterizes it.
Tony didn’t show the emails, either. He just labeled AGP as “intimidated a witness” (where have we seen this one before?) and wrote a post to them saying that he is “done with AGP”. That’s Undie DogWhistle for “AGP is out as a critic of Scientology and should never be listened to, linked to, allowed to participate in any forum that we control again”. Then Tony deleted that comment.
So the word has gone out on AGP, and the Undies will not question this. They will only comply with this information control within their tribe. There is approved information, and that information which is unapproved. Anything from AGP is now in the “unapproved” bin.
I don’t know you, Allison, or why you would ever participate int this kind of activity. But you are. All I can say is that the Church of Scientology’s use of information control was a major reason I got out of Scientology and was willing to endure all their fairgame against me for exposing them.
There is no fucking way I am going to sit by and watch this happen in Anti-Scientology after all that I, and so many of my other fellow critics, have been through.
But WE have not seen the email chain. Why not? AGP is trying to make an argument but is not showing the evidence, why?? He could of wrote a one paragraph post and said see here Tony is lying but he chose not too, why?
One possible reason is that Tony Ortega’s self-serving “intimidating a witness” excuse for silencing AGP is bullshit. He has a pattern of doing this exact thing to competing critics, and their ideas, which goes back years.
You must consider that.
Why AGP could just show us. I don’t understand why you want to run circles when AGP is purposely leaving out half the story.
Because the points that AGP makes in his posts contain important facts and experience, and Tony’s accusations of him are designed to distract from those facts and experiences, and to discredit AGP personally as an information source.
Red dot on the floor! Now it’s on the wall!!
Go get it, Allison!!!
(That was a joke, please don’t be offended. It’s not just you but all the Undies who are being played by Tony Ortega)
Interesting watching the Bunkerites coming here – like they used to come to Marty’s blog – to insist on proof that the statements of their Maximum Journalist are NOT true. “Can you prove it didn’t happen?” is the mantram of partisan hacks, inside or outside cults.
I have never commented on Tony’s blog. But I can use logic. You can’t make a case with out all the evidence AGP has the email chain he made the decision not to post the whole thing.
Allison is correct. This blog represents an attempt to present all the evidence, but the walls seem to be closing in…
Alanzo ,you are pointing the laser dot, Allison is just refusing to chase it. Good for her.
Allison wants the question answered that AGP “intimidated a witness”.
But aren’t the questions that AGP raised more important? I think so. Tony has said over and over that he “knows” where Shelly is, has reported that the police have gone out to perform a welfare check on her and said she was fine, while also playing the “Shelly’s Missing!” and the “Where’s Shelly?” game.
Can you see the manipulation here?
And so here we have a person who Tony has quoted on a story about Shelly looking skinny and weak, showing up in a hardware store with two guys, who Tony characterizes as “minders” – with absolutely no evidence at all – while he paints this whole picture of an “imprisoned” Shelly Miscavige. And yet now we find out that Tony’s source is a person who has never even met Shelly Miscavige. She saw a woman in a store with two guys and then saw a picture on TV days later and thought it was Shelly. Tony offers us her “eyewitness account” with none of this information about his source, taking everything she said as the gospel. (Or for Tony, as an atheist, taking everything as “Christopher Hitchens”)
No one ever questions why, or how, Tony Ortega knows anything that he is talking about with regard to Shelly Miscavige. Tony has repeatedly demionstrated that he is not capable of understanding what life is like for a Scientologist, just as Chuck Beatty implied in his reply to AGP. Tony continues his characterizations of Shelly’s “imprisonment”, when he does not even know if Shelly is in California, are never questioned.
Tony, as we’ve seen in his characterizations of Mark Rathbun working for the Church of Scientology, cherry picks information and builds a narrative that he repeats over and over. And everyone just keeps swallowing it.
These are the kinds of things that are much more important to be questioned, not whether AGP, who raised the questions, is a “witness intimidator”.
That’s why I think what AGP has to say is more important than Tony’s attempts to intimidate AGP into silence, as a witness to Tony’s source on this story.
No one sees Tony Ortega’s witness intimidation of AGP here.
My last two morning tweets to Tony Ortega sum up my feelings about him:
Sometimes it takes me weeks and weeks to finally be able to express in writing what I really feel on a particular subject.
It’s like passing a kidney stone for me.
I feel so much better now.
As annoying as AGP and AnonOrange can be, unlike Tony O they’re goofballs who don’t take themselves seriously at all https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oCBx3H_pqec and they aren’t deliberately mean and vicious the way Tony O is. I’ve had more than a few run-ins with AGP when my reluctant ass would get dragged in now and then to work liaison duties between PAC/HGB base security and law enforcement, but his antics were so over the top that as long as he kept his antics out of visual and earshot range of children, I always advised ignoring him, which usually wasn’t difficult to convince others since he’s HIV+ and well, you know how that goes when it comes to Sea Org. If I’d tell someone that he wasn’t worth confronting because the HIV had literally rotted most of his brain functions and was on the verge of full-blown AIDS, they’d accept it without question and it always worked whenever I used it. It was a total lie on my part, but it put the fear of God into ’em and they’d keep their distance and avoid him like the plague and leave any interactions and confrontations to legitimate law enforcement officers.
Unfortunately, he never made things easy for anyone when he’d strut and scream around raw and non-scn publics at places like the testing center, which fortunately for me wasn’t in my area of responsibility. Overall he could be something of a nightmare, albeit an entertaining one and an endless source of amusement for most Sea Org as we never had any opportunity to witness genuine screwball comedy. Hell, the whole time I was in I can’t remember when I had time to watch even a few minutes of television.
Tony O on the other hand, while not a nightmare and definitely not funny and entirely lacking in class and character, is just a gaping asshole suffering from excess diarrhea of opinion and not enough factual fiber to keep his bowels in check. Tsk, tsk.
Are you trying to gross people out here?
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